by Aldo Cazullo
The journalist: «Why do I often invite Bersani? he has Calvino’s key: he explains difficult things to you with ease ». And about Fornero: “A woman who got involved and, unlike other ministers of Monti, has not disappeared”
Giovanni Floris, is it right to give a voice to No Vax on TV yesterday and Pro Putin today?
“Generally, yes. Every voice must be heard. Conversations are there for exactly that: to compare different ideas ».
Have you noticed that sometimes they are the same people?
“Sure; and that’s not surprising. The no to vaccines and Putin’s often unacknowledged typhus are the result of the same cultural and political phenomenon: opposition to the system. And how can you close your eyes in the face of this phenomenon? How can you not say? “.
Don’t you find talking about narcissism unbearable?
“Don’t confuse the effect with the cause. What you call daffodils is the product of the country’s transformation; not the origin”.
Some have risen to the ranks of iconic figures.
“There are two strands. The anti-systems that oppose rationality and its banal simplicity with the idea of a conspiracy. And then there is the conspiracy of science to force the vaccine on us; and there is the conspiracy of the West that wants to foment the war ».
And the other strand?
“It seems even more interesting to me, also because little has been said about it so far. It’s the hyper-realistic trend or convenience ».
Give me an example of the sense of expediency applied to the vaccine.
“For me, who am young, vaccination is not comfortable because I don’t mind Covid. The idea that it serves society and others is not discarded; it’s not really taken into account”.
Is it applied to war?
«Should Ukrainians defend their country or not? It doesn’t suit him. Better let Putin in. Would they lose their freedom? Patience; they would stay alive: it’s cheaper. I’m not talking about peace strategies, I don’t want to say whether it’s right or wrong to arm the Ukrainians … ».
Tell me instead: is it right?
«Of course it is right to arm the Ukrainian resistance fighters. Just as it is right to bring Putin to the negotiating table at the price of phoning him 20 times a day, as Macron explained in an interview with Corriere; otherwise, if the Democratic leaders don’t call it, the Asians will call it. The dynamic of escalation must be counteracted. Europe is to blame for not defusing Putin before he went unchallenged; now it would be right that some of his many friends that I have seen at parades in recent years would call him … But what interests me as a journalist is to think about a mindset ».
Means what?
“The logic of whether it’s convenient or not is increasingly taking the place of right or wrong. If there were a balance between the two logics, that would be a good thing; when only the first is over, the individual is saved, but his world changes. A world becomes acceptable in which the old man dies, in which freedom can be given up, in which convenience decides who and what stays. Collective responsibility, freedom itself becomes the limit; and knocking it down opens the door to a world that we’re not necessarily going to like ».
What world would it be?
«Exactly: no longer having any empathy for the partisan who died for freedom, what does that lead to? Taking Covid lightly, not caring if some old people die in the meantime, what does that lead to? Maybe to save several people; but probably to the downfall of many. Certainly, towards the dissolution of the collective subjects: the trade unions, the parties, the peoples in sight. Everything can become comfortable, even letting others decide about your life. Maybe the dictator, the invader. It depends on what you offer in return. For example life against freedom ».
Wasn’t that always the case?
“No. As kids, we lined up at school or in the military to get vaccinated. Would our kids, who we lead by example today, stand in the same row? Some of us, for the good of the team and for a avoiding the opposing attacker’s goal, getting a yellow card. Would our children do that? Would they leave the last piece of cake to the mother? And how does the dessert taste if you eat everything yourself and leave nothing to your family? ».
Haven’t the politicians you’ve invited to your lecture for years always used their personal convenience as their compass?
“Sure; but in a general framework. Now we’re really losing the picture ».
But she has her favorite guests. For example Bersani.
“Bersani has Calvino’s key: he explains difficult things to you with ease”.
You also have a passion for Fornero.
“A woman who got involved and, unlike other Monti ministers, has not disappeared.”
And then Ilaria Capua.
“You have, like Barbara Gallavotti, able to explain science with humanity”.
But don’t you think that masks work best in conversations, preferably introduced by circus music? The guarantor, the executioner, and tomorrow why not the tamer or the bearded woman?
“The opposite is true. An episode made entirely of masks is sure to go wrong: like those movies where you immediately understand who the killer is. The ideal host is the one you never know what to say about ; and maybe someday you’ll discover that the killer is the detective. I don’t care about the mask; I’m interested in the sincere. You can be clumsy, clumsy; but if you are sincere, the audience will listen to you ».
Is your audience left-leaning?
«Since the days of Ballarò, they have always followed us here and there. It’s better now because there is no longer the split into two camps; the studio has become oval or polygonal and we can read reality in its various facets. For conversations, beyond malevolence, are a place of cultural study.”
Does Mediaset have the right watch?
“Not just the right thing. I think Nicola Porro has an audience of moderates, of liberals. But both Mario Giordano and Paolo Del Debbio have many viewers on the left, or who once voted on the left. Popular Classes. Keep in mind that some pollsters indicate the League as the first workers’ party in Italy, which also has a lot of support from volunteers.
Will the right win the next election?
“It’s likely; but I don’t know if he can govern. That will depend on Berlusconi. And every time Berlusconi has had to choose – from Monti to Draghi, from vaccines to war – he has chosen to stay with the system remain, against the populists”.
How is your personal duel with Bianca Berlinguer going?
“The Sardinians don’t duel. Do you remember the war cry of the Sassari Brigade? Forza Paris! ».
What does that mean?
“Come together.”
April 30, 2022 (Change April 30, 2022 | 10:16)
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