Salvador Illa (La Roca del Vallès, Barcelona; 57 years old) has made discretion the main feature of his political identity, both when he was Minister of Health and now that he leads the PSC. At a crucial moment in its creation, with all the spotlight on Catalonia as the pro-independence parties play a major role in Pedro Sánchez’s inauguration, Illa maintains ironclad secrecy but offers hints of what might come in the elections. next weeks. Their aim is for the amnesty negotiations to result in a text that is firmly anchored in the constitution and is not quick but “solid”. He calls on independents to recognize Catalonia’s “plurality” before prioritizing any departure from its political foundations.
Questions. What phase exactly are the investiture negotiations in?
Answer. We are at the beginning of the process, the legal deadline for which is November 27th. We will try to get it done as quickly as possible, but the most important thing is that it is done well and is solvent.
Q A week ago there was turmoil when the independence movement linked investiture to the referendum. The Socialists made it clear that there was room for an amnesty, but not for the referendum. Was it a tactical advantage for you to weaken the significance of the amnesty?
“Pedro Sánchez has made it clear that there will be no agreement until everything is agreed.”
R. There is no tactic, but rather the conviction that a policy has produced results in the economic and social spheres and in the creation of coexistence. And the willingness to consistently follow these guidelines. A PP and Vox government would be a setback for Spain.
What influences the most is what happens next. So you don’t miss anything, subscribe.
Subscribe to
Q When the government granted the pardons, in many areas there was a lack of a better explanation of the benefit of the measure. Will this be solved now with the amnesty?
R. For any objective observer of Catalan reality, the pardons helped restore harmony. And also for Spanish society. It is the basis of support for Sánchez on the 23rd.
Salvador Illa, this Friday in the editorial office of El País in Barcelona. MASSIMILIANO MINOCRI
Q Will the amnesty law be ready before the inauguration?
R. The important thing is not that it happens quickly, but that it happens well.
Q ERC says the amnesty has already been agreed. Is that so?
R. We explain the agreements, if any.
Q But is it or not?
R. If there are agreements, we make them public. And we haven’t made anything public.
A failed investiture would cause a lot of frustration in Catalonia.”
Q Are you a supporter of amnesty?
R. I’m ready to deal with the results of 23-J. And they say no to a PP and Vox government and yes to a progressive government under Sánchez. A governance formula must be formulated with dialogue, coherence, discretion and political skill.
Q He had always resisted her. What is the change?
R. The aim was to overcome the painful events of 2017 through dialogue and to strengthen harmony. The policy applied has brought noticeable results.
Q Pedro Sánchez used the word amnesty for the first time on Friday. Why did you find it so difficult to put it into words?
R. We must respect the political times. It was the time of [el líder del PP, Alberto Núñez] Feijóo, who failed. Sánchez has named his negotiating team as a candidate. If there are policies that work, it makes sense to push them forward, even if they are inconvenient.
The aim was to overcome the painful events of 2017 through dialogue.
Q You can say things with her name.
R. I try to work with caution and discretion and make it clear that I am committed to the framework of the Constitution.
Q Sánchez says the amnesty would serve to overcome the legal consequences of one of the worst territorial crises Spain has ever experienced. Do you think that this measure would complete the process?
R. The President made it very clear that there will be no agreement until everything is agreed. You have to go step by step, and it’s not very wise to venture into future scenarios. What we know is that Catalonia in 2023 is much better than that of 2017. And President Sánchez’s policies have a lot to do with that.
Q Can this happen without the independence movement abandoning the unilateral path?
R. We are committed to dialogue and agreed solutions that reflect a large majority of Catalan society. Catalonia has turned the page on the confrontations and recipes that have generated so much tension. We want to move forward and not repeat the mistakes of the past. Socialists advocate coexistence, not tension.
Q Would you like the preamble of the future law to state that the events of 2017 and the renunciation of unilateral independence will not be repeated?
R. We are in a phase of discussions. And I perceive an attitude in Catalan society that wants to put very painful events behind it. For this reason, I try to adopt a stance that corresponds to what I perceive, without naivety, and that my training acts with generosity to give vent to the feeling that I perceive. I trust that we all have a high vision. We will not ask anyone to give up their political ideas, but we must all recognize the plurality of Catalonia and the plurality of Spain, that there are different ways of thinking.
Q There are 22 judgments of the Constitutional Court that can support amnesty, but they also make it clear that not every type of it is enough. What are the limits?
R. We will not do anything outside the framework of the Constitution.
Q Are you in favor of referring to the dialogue table what cannot be agreed upon during negotiations, including the referendum?
R. I am committed to ensuring that investiture is achieved and that the agreement lasts throughout the entire legislative period.
Q Other important issues for self-government will also be discussed in the negotiations, such as the transfer of Cercanías or new financing. Do you think an agreement on these points is feasible?
R. There is an agenda with issues on different competences, but we have to let the negotiators work discreetly.
Q Can independence rivalry thwart investiture?
R. I am convinced that this is not the case. We are all aware of the times we live in and what citizens demand.
Q What do you think of the figure of mediator proposed by former President Carles Puigdemont? Is anyone from the PSC on the negotiating team?
R. We will let President Sánchez and his team, who will hold talks with the groups except Vox, do their job. Regarding Catalonia, he has already said that he will maintain the dialogue with me and the PSC, which is already very fluid.
Q Puigdemont has denied him interlocutor status in these negotiations. Are you going to retire?
R. I won’t go into that: I ask for respect for the election results of the Junts, the PSC and the rest of the parties. Catalonia has gone through difficult times that have led to frustration. The failed inauguration of Pedro Sánchez would cause further frustration in Catalonia. And the Catalans cannot stumble from frustration to frustration.
Q Travel to Brussels this week. Will he meet Puigdemont?
R. No, that’s not on the agenda.
Q Have you talked to him? Or do you have intention?
R. This did not happen.
Q If investiture fails, won’t you vote on state budgets like you did a year ago?
R. We try not to mix. Its impact can be greatly improved and it has lost support, but we don’t want anything to go wrong; We want to help them do well.
Q Is Sumar’s amnesty proposal consistent with the PSOE’s proposals?
R. I just want to remind you that it is not Sumar, but Pedro Sánchez who will appeal to the Chamber’s trust. If they strive for prominence? I don’t know it. We try to act with great caution and respect for procedures. It is appropriate to do this with discretion and always make this clear within the framework of the Constitution. And with all due respect, let everyone do what they think they can do.
Salvador Illa, this Friday in the EL PAÍS editorial office in Barcelona. MASSIMILIANO MINOCRI
Q Today there is a demonstration against the amnesty in Barcelona. You have spoken out to the Societat Civil in the past. Is this a strange situation for you?
R. I don’t share it. I want certain leaders to come to Catalonia to listen, feel it, know it and help create bonds of coexistence. My project is not based on competing against anyone or competing with anyone. I try to work to create connections and bridges.
Q Do you think the PP will go to this demonstration to try to set fire to Catalonia?
R. I don’t know it. What I know is that the seat difference with the PP in Catalonia is 13. And four years ago there were 10. And that is not open to interpretation: it is objective.
Q The PSC appeared on June 23 without including the amnesty in its program. Are you worried that your change of position will have an impact on the election?
R. I don’t know it. A large part of Catalan society has recognized that the PSC has tried to resolve very complicated situations in moments of discomfort. And we will continue to do so, without naivety, but with generosity and recognizing the plurality of Catalonia. And then the citizens will say. It seems that we are not doing too badly at the moment.
You can follow EL PAÍS Catalunya on Facebook and Xor sign up here to receive our weekly newsletter
Subscribe to continue reading
Read without limits