The Israeli army has begun its ground operation, particularly targeting Hamas’s underground network, a real city beneath the city, a labyrinth of almost impenetrable tunnels. These are complementary networks that have long been used and integrated into the strategy of terrorist groups. They are increasingly trying to use them for their strategic goals. A network that blinds Israel’s intelligence gathering efforts. Interview with Daphné Richemond-Barak, urban conflict specialist, professor at the International Counterterrorism Institute at Reichman University in Tel Aviv.
RFI: You are the author of “The Underground War.” Have you been able to visit certain tunnels built by Hamas?
Daphne Richemond Barak : I was in the tunnels on the Gaza-Israel border, on the Israeli side, that went under the border. And I was also in the tunnels dug by Hezbollah. So once again at the border on Israeli territory. Hamas has been working on the Hamas tunnels for 20 years, so this is not a big surprise to Israel and should not be a surprise to the world, because it is a long-term effort that Hamas has undertaken and is extremely complex and to build a highly developed underground network that effectively makes Hamas almost impenetrable.
Furthermore, they allow Hamas to operate far from the technological eyes of the State of Israel and the Israeli army, which is nonetheless one of the most efficient armies in the world. The main goal of these tunnels is precisely to reduce this strategic advantage that Israel has over a terrorist group like Hamas and to completely neutralize all its advantage, which may be asymmetrical between a state with a successful army and a terrorist group on the other side .
What do these tunnels look like?
You enter a Hamas tunnel; it is completely dark. You can’t see anything, it seems endless. You don’t know if there are arteries that go to the right or left, if there are ladders, if there are stairs, but they definitely exist. You don’t see them. It may be that there are people in these tunnels, but you can’t see them either. As soon as you enter the tunnel you lose all sense of direction, you no longer have the slightest idea what is happening. Are you going to Gaza? Are you going to Egypt? You completely lose your reference points. You lose all sense of direction, you are disoriented. It’s claustrophobia. It’s extremely scary and a bit like a nightmare: once you go in, you don’t really know how to get out.
You mention the difference between the different tunnels. Is there a typology of tunnels built and developed by Hamas?
A distinction is often made between tunnels that are used for attack purposes and those used for defense purposes. I reject this “typology”. For what ? Because for me a tunnel is a tunnel. This means that from a strategic perspective, a tunnel can be used for a whole range of reasons. It can be used to carry out an attack, carry out an ambush, kidnap civilians or soldiers, or orchestrate human trafficking. On the other hand, not all tunnels are the same and the way to fight them, the way to discover them, the way to eliminate them are not necessarily the same either. The tunnels in Gaza, the underground network created by Hamas, are now the subject of the Israeli offensive.
There are the tunnels on the Gaza-Israel border that have been widely talked about, including that of Ein Hashlosha in 2013, but there are also some that were discovered during Operation Protective Edge, for example in 2014. There are They that are located in southern Lebanese territory, we call them nature reserves. They have been around for a very long time, so again it is nothing new in this region of the Middle East, but each network has its peculiarities. Finally, there are those that are also built by Hamas and go to Egypt. These are located between the Gaza Strip and Egypt and were mainly used for arms smuggling. Egypt tried to eliminate them, but without much success. And today there is a likelihood that these tunnels between Gaza and Egypt, a different kind of tunnel, were used to supply weapons to Hamas before the October 7 attack.
How big is this network?
The scope is immense. The Gaza Strip is a relatively small area. But these tunnels are not built linearly, but in zigzags. They are on several levels. In addition, the hostages who were in these tunnels say that they walked for kilometers because there are kilometers of tunnels and these tunnels are not yesterday’s news, that is, if you compare it with what is happening with Daesh in Syria and Iraq is They were in the tunnels, but tunnels were used for maybe a few weeks, a few months. What is happening in Gaza is on a completely different level. It’s much more sophisticated, it’s modern. Yes, it actually looks like what we show in these films released by the Israeli army.
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How tall are you? How are they composed?
There are arteries, there are rooms, there are halls, there are doors, electricity, there are places where Hamas lives – underground. It’s a real military base. It is a military base among civilians, which is a war crime in itself, but above all endangers the population of Gaza. This military base beneath their feet exposes them to explosions and collapses. As a result, they are exposed to military attacks by the Israeli army and are the first victims of this underground war. Most underground passages are not very wide.
But you should know that if there is an influence from Iran, things may have changed a little. It’s hard to say for sure today, but we could see things like North Korea or Iran, wider passages that we could pass on a motorcycle, possibly a truck. It’s not confirmed, but it’s possible. There may be places where weapons are manufactured and stored. A military achievement worthy of a state.
How is it that Israel knows so little about Hamas’ activities?
Precisely because of the tunnels, Israel is blinded by these tunnels, which prevent it from knowing what Hamas is planning, as we have clearly seen. One of the reasons why Israel did not see what happened on October 7th is because it was planned underground and it is very difficult to have communication networks there. The information is very limited.
If Israel doesn’t really know what it is going to destroy and what method to use, then how can this entire network be destroyed?
Operationally, this is an extremely complicated mission. For what ? Because there is a threefold challenge. Most importantly, we are in an urban area where there is a population. Even if we had requested evacuation, there would definitely be something left, it was urban land with houses, mosques, etc. Furthermore, underground warfare itself is extremely complicated. We see this in the fact that states have always used their most powerful weapons against tunnels, be it in Vietnam, during World War I or even during World War II.
Finally, we have to add an additional challenge: the hostages that are in the tunnels. There are priorities that must be taken into account: between the lives of the hostages, the lives of innocent civilians in Gaza and the risk that the soldiers have put themselves in these tunnels prepared by Hamas. It’s about finding a balance between these different, actually completely mutually exclusive priorities and trying to master this challenge militarily. Israel must succeed in this triple challenge, and from a military perspective it is almost insurmountable.
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Could all of this determine the outcome of the war?
We are talking about neighbors who are only a few meters away from the border. We are talking about the fact that these “neighbors” act in a coordinated manner, not always on the same wavelength, but in coordination with what is happening in the West Bank, Lebanon and Iran. So this is a regional effort, and I think for Israel it’s an existential war. At this point in time there is neither talk of a defeat in the war nor of a ceasefire, because it is about the right to self-defense. It’s embarrassing, it’s slow. There will be casualties, there will be civilian casualties and military casualties. It’s like that, it’s tedious and it’s tragic.
These tunnels in Gaza, on the borders, in Lebanon, in Egypt… Can they be eradicated?
In order to completely eliminate them, you have to know them all. We have to discover them all. You have to know exactly where they are going, where they are leaving… This is a huge task. But there are strategies that can be implemented, for example, constant monitoring of the border to see if there are trucks there transporting earth, to see if sheds are being built to somewhat hide these tunneling activities. The tunnels are getting deeper and deeper. Hamas benefits from all this know-how acquired in Syria and Iraq. You should know that there may also be influence from Iran. We are not necessarily at the end of our surprises yet and while Israel has improved its capabilities in this area, you should know that on the other hand, Hamas has also learned and invested. This is the reality of a race between the two parties.
Daphné Richemond-Barak, urban conflict specialist, professor at the International Counterterrorism Institute at Reichman University in Tel Aviv. © Clea Broadhurst / RFI