[Editor’s note: To mark the return of one of television’s best shows—that’s Barry, the third season of which premieres Sunday, April 24—The A.V.Club is rolling out a different piece of content about the series over the next seven days. To kick things off, we sat down with the man himself, Bill Hader.]
It’s been three agonizing years since Barry Berkman took on – and won – the Chechen-Burmese-Bolivian mob in a breathtaking killing spree that capped off an incredible second season for HBO’s Barry.
Not long after “berkman > block” aired on May 19, 2019, co-creator and star Bill Hader took home the Emmy for Outstanding Lead Actor in a Comedy Series, while the show garnered four other nominations. Then Hader and co-creator Alec Berg embarked on season three with big plans (and just as much pressure) to answer the question all fans are asking: What will Barry do now that Henry Winkler’s Gene Couisneau knows who Killed Janice?
Cut to Hader in 2022 chatting about Barry with The AV Club via Zoom. Demand for his show (and answers to their most burning questions) is still feverish, but audiences haven’t been with Barry for a minute – and the world he’s returning to is seriously different.
In our conversation, Hader breaks down the rewriting, reshooting, and eventual return to Barry, what to expect for the heartbreakingly hapless killer, and which episode of Season 3 Hader most wants viewers to watch.
Watch portions of our conversation with Bill Hader below, or read on for the full chat.
The AV Club: So Barry Season 2 ended in May 2019. Now they’re returning with Season 3 in April 2022. What did you miss most about working on your show?
Bill Hader: Probably the people that are there, the crew and the cast and just being with those people every day. That was really what I missed the most, to be honest. I didn’t miss the shooting hours. [Laughs.] But yeah, it probably was – it was nice to see everyone again and just have that kind of camaraderie again. It’s a nice family.
AVC: When we last left Barry, he was in a difficult position – to say the least. How did you approach writing and returning to a character that has been left on a cliffhanger for so long?
BRA: Well, we tend to write ourselves in corners, so we had no idea how to get out of there. So I remember the first day we wrote season three, that was October 2019, when we were like, “So Couisneau knows. Shit. What are we doing?” So we really just had to try and figure that out.
Bill Hader as Barry Berkman in Barry Season Three, Episode OnePhoto Credit: Merrick Morton/HBO
AVC: Henry Winkler has said that the script has changed quite dramatically from what you had in 2019 to what you have now. What can you say about this rewriting process and how coming out of this corner has evolved over time?
BRA: A lot of it was that we started talking about season four and what a fourth season would be like. So when we talked about it, we went back to season three and changed a few things. Because we’re like, “Oh, if we were going to be here, maybe it would be better to set it up that way.” You know? So we went through that process, and as we did, more and more things came along [we wanted to change].
Usually you just want to go deeper. You have to say, “Is that interesting? Is that really?” And then you try to go a little bit deeper with that. Then you shoot it and you’re like, ‘We’ve got it!’ And then you show it to people, and then you’re like, ‘Oh, we don’t have it Got it.” We had to go back and reshoot some stuff and go even deeper and try to make it as honest and true as possible.
Barry does many things that he doesn’t feel have consequences. He’s pretty horrible to the people he loves this season. Standing against the wall, he does not think about his own anger and anger. Now he’s learning that everything has consequences
AVC: In the Season 2 finale, Barry had to find out that he really couldn’t change. As a storyteller, how do you make the lack of change compelling?
BRA: We would always say it was like [Barry] was an alcoholic and at the start of the season he said, “I’m not going to drink anymore.” And then he doesn’t drink all season long, but he wants to and the universe keeps introducing him to things that make him want to drink . And then, in the last episode, he goes on a bend. So it’s kind of trying to make those real comparisons or emotional comparisons with this elevated, crazy thing of a guy who’s a killer.
I think in the third season he learns that there is such a thing [consequences]. Barry does many things that he doesn’t feel have consequences. He’s pretty horrible to the people he loves this season. Standing against the wall, he does not think about his own anger and anger. Now he’s learning that everything has consequences.
Bill Hader as Barry Berkman (left) and Henry Winkler as Gene Cousineau (right) in the third season of BarryPhoto Credit: Merrick Morton/HBO
AVC: Season 3 episode one is titled Forgiving Jeff. Why is a season centered around the theme of forgiveness important to Barry as a show?
BRA: It kind of happened naturally. We wrote it, scene by scene, really went from what [Barry] goes through. Then this idea of salvation and forgiveness and these real things started to rise to the top. That was a lot of this rewriting process. It was like, “While this stuff is here, let’s explore it [deeply enough]?” These ideas of “forgiveness has to be earned” and all that – that came during the rewriting process.
AVC: In yours Emmy acceptance speech 2019, you have spoken extensively about your collaboration and friendship with Alec Berg, the co-creator of Barry. How did your relationship change between seasons two and three?
BRA: Not too much has changed. The biggest thing is that when we started I had no idea what I was doing. He was like my big brother and he said, “I ran Silicon Valley and Curb Your Enthusiasm and all that.” He really helped me. Then I think during season two, especially really with that episode “Ronny/Lily,” he was really encouraging and said, “Yeah, do it!”
Jessi Giacomazzi, Bill Hader and Stephen Root in Barry Season 2, Episode 5, “ronny/lily” Photo: Aaron Epstein/HBO
So, more and more often, he tells me, “Yeah, run with that mind.” He’s that great breed of collaborator-slash-like trainer. I directed five of the episodes this season, so I directed most of them. And it was really wonderful and very relaxed.
AVC: Do you have an episode that you’re particularly proud of this season?
BRA: Oh I really like them all. I’ll say I really like the last episode – but I’m interested to see what people think. [Laughs.] It’s pretty… Yes. I do not know. I don’t know what people will think of this. But I like that one.
The first word that came to mind was “fucked”.
AVC: Now I’ll round you off with a couple of quick-fire questions. What’s your favorite line your character says?
BRA: In the first season where he says to Fuches, “That’s toxic masculinity,” and it’s clear he doesn’t know what that means.
AVC: Have you ever picked up a souvenir from the set?
BRA: My shoes! The boots. I have about nine pairs in my house. But it’s not like a souvenir. I’m lazy and I carry them home. I carry my wardrobe at home a lot because I’m directing and we’re going to be in one place and the trailers are somewhere else entirely. And I was like, “Oh, I’ll just go home in my costume.” Then [the wardrobe department] is always like, “Can you bring it back to work tomorrow, please?” And I’m like, “Absolutely.” Then I’ll show up and be like, “I forgot.” [Laughs.] So I have a lot of Barry clothes just in my closet. And yes, I need to get this back to work.
AVC: Describe Barry season 3 in one word.
BRA: [Laughs] The first word that came to mind was “fucked”. [Laughs] Yes… it’s fucked up.
Bil Hader as Barry Berkman in Barry Season 3, Episode 2Photo Credit: Merrick Morton/HBO